Review for 4x03 'In The Beginning'

[galathea]

Sorry this review comes so late, but my sister stayed with me over the last few days, so I couldn’t follow my urges to just sit down for a couple of hours to write down my thoughts about the episode and had to sneak in time here and there over the weekend to formulate short paragraphs. I hope it's still coherent nonetheless. ;)

Anyway, wow, the show ups its ante considerably this season! In The Beginning draws the mytharc together in a fashion that leaves me stunned and breathless. Jeremy Carver wrote an excellent script and once again proved to be the most valuable addition to the writer’s staff in a very long while. S4 so far just defines new standards for this show and even this far into the story, Supernatural still manages to surprise me! My show just rocks! ♥



First off, I was wary when I read about the episode, not because of the content itself, but because I knew that Sam would have next to no part in this episode and I usually dislike it if the boys are separated or if one of them is sidelined. This is especially true for Sam, since I feel that Sam’s side of the story has been neglected for quite a while now and we don’t get the kind of insight the character deserves. After watching In The Beginning though, I think that not only the plot development was worth Sam’s absence, in the end the whole episode turned out to be about Sam after all and all my objections were blown away by the way this episode managed to tie up loose ends and reflect back on all the seasons that came before.

S4 so far focuses on the mytharc and the Winchesters and I like that. Not that I don’t enjoy a good case file, but since S3 had to cut all storylines apart from Dean’s deal, I am glad that they deliver the missing puzzle pieces so early in the new season instead of dragging it out. The gravity of the events Sam and Dean went through and the new mythology developments easily justify a deviation from their usual episode pattern of one mytharc episode followed by 4-5 standalones. I love how much direction, energy and mystery the new season displays so far and I hope that they can maintain that. Kripke stated that S3 was a transitional season and he admitted that the writing lacked a bit of focus. This year though they seem to be back to their top form; I haven’t been this excited about a season in a while. ♥

Dean: "Oh, I care, I care a lot, but these are my parents. I’m not gonna let them die again. I can’t. Not if I can stop it!"

Dean’s reunion with his parents and grandparents was an absolute joy to watch. I loved the little moments in his encounter with John: For example, just last episode Dean mentioned they should visit the Star Trek experience and here we learn that it was John who was the Star Trek fan, showing another interest that Dean shared with his father. The scene where Dean convinced John to buy the Impala instead of the van Mary wanted was a wonderful touch as well. Dean’s wonderment at experiencing his father as the naïve civilian, the sweet kid next door with no other ambitions than to build a family and a home of his own, was amusing and sad at the same time. To see John so innocent here, makes his later development into the revenge driven, withdrawn and mistrusting drill sergeant all the more tragic. Especially since meeting the Campbells just again drove the point home that it is possible for hunters to have a steady home base as a family, with all the domestic and social benefits and still pursue a hunting career.

As so often it is Dean’s interaction with Mary though, that touched me the most. His heartbroken expression when Mary confesses that she wants out of the life as a hunter, that she hates the thought of her children being raised like herself and Dean’s desperate attempt to warn his mother about the fateful night that will change all of their lives, were heart-wrenching. Jensen again knocked these emotional scenes out of the park. ♥ To see Mary make a demonic deal for his father’s life, just like he did for his brother, must have hit Dean hard. He knows first hand how grief and desperation can drive a person to make a rash decision like that and still, I wonder if witnessing his mother’s deal affected Dean’s opinion of her. I guess only time will tell.

Dean’s conversation with Castiel in the car was a beautiful reversal of his one-sided conversation with (dead) John in What Is and What Should Never Be. Back then Dean chose to give up personal happiness and the safety of his family for the greater good, but since then he lost everything he had left, his brother, his life, his soul, and he is done sacrificing his family for the well-being of others. We know he does care deeply about the people he saved, but here he seemingly has the opportunity to change the course of the lives of the people he cares about the most and he seizes it. This decision is especially interesting as it comes just after Dean was faced with the more negative consequences of his life as a hunter last episode and I wouldn’t be surprised if his feelings of guilt towards the people he couldn’t save played at least a small role in his decision making here.

Mary: "I wanna get out. This job, this life, I hate it. I want a family. I want to be safe. You know the worst thing I can think of, the very worst thing? Is for my children to be raised into this, like I was."

I have to admit that I didn’t see it coming at all that Mary was a hunter, raised in a family of hunters. That's an utterly brilliant plot twist. ♥ I adore how Mary mirrored Sam completely in her wish to flee into normalcy for the illusion of safety. While Sam took refuge at Stanford and in his relationship with Jessica, Mary tried to escape into her marriage with John but in the end their unwillingness to face reality hurt the people around them. Mary refused to tell John the truth about herself, thus denying them the opportunity to be prepared when the YED came to collect his debt. Sam didn’t tell Jessica the truth about himself and ignored his nightmares, also wasting any opportunity to prevent what happened.

I also love that Sam’s question "You think Mom would have wanted that (life) for us?" to Dean in the Pilot turned out to be entirely accurate in its assessment. Mary’s abhorrence at the thought of her children being raised as hunters was heart-breaking in the light of the events of the first three seasons. It’s an immense tragedy that by making the deal for John’s life, she achieved the very thing she feared the most. She unknowingly sacrificed the future of her unborn child for her own happiness, thus starting the vicious circle of deals in her family and that’s an extremely fitting twist in the Winchester saga. Now her apology to Sam in Home makes perfect sense and I am incredibly pleased that the show managed to tie up this loose end so satisfyingly.

It has to be said though, that if Dean hadn’t mentioned Liddy Walsh to Samuel, Mary and her father would have never been at her house, trying to save her and the YED might have never noticed Mary and targeted her and her family. That by trying to save his family Dean inadvertently caused the very events that would lead to Mary’s deal is an utterly devastating thought though. Of course it’s entirely possible that the YED would have targeted Mary no matter if Dean interfered or not, as Castiel stated, all roads lead to the same destination, still if the time travel was a genuine event it is possible that sending back Dean in order to show him the truth may be the very thing that sealed the Winchester’s fate.

Dean: "So these deals you’re making, you don’t want those people’s souls?"
YED: "No, I just want their children. I’m here to choose the perfect parents, like your mommy. (…) So far she’s my favourite!"

The YED was back and once again I realised how much I miss him. His menacing presence, his sarcasm, the sadistic streak; he was the most memorable villain in the show and so far Lilith just pales in comparison. The YED’s unique persona obviously inspires the actors as well, since just like Jeffrey Dean Morgan or Fredric Lehne, Mitch Pileggi visibly stepped up his game when he impersonated the YED. His exchange with Dean was excellent, creepy and intense, very reminiscent of Devil’s Trap. I love how easily recognisable the YED is, no matter who plays him.

So far most of the new information about the YED’s plans ties in with the previous seasons. He makes deals with young people, tempting them into giving him permission to enter their houses, 10 years from the day the deal was made, in order to be able to exact his blood ritual on their infants. The fact that he needs to be invited into a house is interesting and explains why he interacted with his psychic kids in dreams rather than in person. Since we have seen possessed people enter houses without problems, it stands to reason that only in their pure form demons are denied that possibility, which would mean that the body the YED used in the Pilot or Salvation was indeed a materialization of the YED himself, rather than a possession. That would also explain why he simply dissolved when Sam shot at him in Salvation, while Dean was able to kill him when he possessed the janitor. It’s possible that they are only vulnerable to the Colt when trapped inside a person.

Another interesting fact was that the YED showed no fear or surprise about the obvious interference of angels with the timeline. I guess he either concluded from that, that his plans in the future were a success, bringing forth the heavenly armies as a result or he is indeed evenly matched to angels in power and doesn’t fear them out of arrogance. I wonder if the YED was already around 2000 years ago, when angels roamed the earth the last time. In any case his indifference towards the angelic assistance for Dean stood in stark contrast to the reactions of the standard demons we saw so far.

There are only two minor problems with the YED’s story I can make out so far. Firstly, the YED stated that he can't bring people back from the dead in In My Time Of Dying. That was directly contradicted here. Secondly, in Salvation it was implied that the YED was dormant between exacting the blood ritual and the time the psychic kids came of age, which is why John never picked up his trail before 2005. Now we learn that he was active after all, closing the deals for every new generation of psychic kids, so theoretically there should have been omens of his presence for example in 1996, when the YED made the deal with Rosie’s mother (and presumably others). If John checked on everyone who ever may have come in contact with the YED and even backtracked the signs to 1973, why didn’t he notice these signs for later years?

It would also be interesting to know when exactly John did all that research. Was that part of what he did while he was vanished and did he add those pages to his journal after he reunited with his sons? After all Sam and Dean had the journal with them and I would expect that they would have noticed that list if it had been in there. So, these details seem a bit shaky to me, but it’s nothing I can’t rationalise away by John’s penchant for keeping secrets or keeping his sons on a strict need to know basis.

Anyway, the new information opens up the question again as to what exactly the YED’s endgame was and if Lilith plans tie in with them at all. If the YED’s plans were the same as Lilith’s, wouldn’t the angels know about it? Why did all of Mary’s friends have to die in order to cover the YED’s plans? What kind of threat did they pose? There are still a lot of question marks but one thing is clear, the human general was a crucial element in the YED’s endgame and I am curious to see how Sam’s latest actions may or may not play into his plans.

Castiel: "Your brother is headed down a dangerous road, Dean. We’re not sure where it leads. So stop it, or we will!"

As already predicted after Lazarus Rising the sole purpose for Dean being returned from hell with angelic assistance lies in preventing Sam’s path towards perdition. That’s why it had to be Dean and nobody else, since he is the only person who has the power to reach his brother. I love how this plotline directs back to S2, pushing Dean’s mission to either save Sam or he might need to be killed to another level. Castiel threatening Sam's life in case Dean fails his mission firmly establishes him as a possible adversary and I really look forward to the potential battle over Sam's salvation between Dean and Castiel. I have to wonder though, that if destiny can’t be changed, why Castiel even offers Dean the possibility to save Sam from the path he has chosen at the moment? If all roads lead to the same destination it should make no difference if Dean interferes or not, Sam would end up wherever he is meant to be, no matter what Dean does.

So far the show has always made a point in emphasising that Sam and Dean’s choices control their fate, that their destiny is not written in stone. Castiel’s own words ”You have to stop it!”, which by the way were wonderfully ambiguous, since he didn’t mean the YED & the past, but Sam & the future, indicate that Dean does indeed have a chance to save his brother and that Sam does have a choice. So either Castiel’s statement about destiny was simply an attempt to reconcile Dean with his failure to save his parents or Castiel tries to manipulate Dean here. Of course it could be just an inconsistency but I reserve judgment on that for when we know more.

Castiel: "Time is fluid, Dean. It’s not easy, but we can bend it on occasion."

In the end a couple of words about the time travel issue. Time travel is always a little mind-bending and tends to either cause paradoxes or general confusion about the events of a timeline. As I see it, there are three possibilities how the time travel aspect of In The Beginning played out:

1. Time is unchangeable. Dean did indeed travel back in time but his presence has always been part of the timeline. That arises the question as to why Mary didn’t heed Dean’s warning or why the YED didn’t consider Dean a threat to his plans. I think these questions are easily answered within the characterisations of Mary and the YED: Since Mary desperately wished to leave the life of a hunter behind, she buried everything tied to her past and embraced 'normalcy' whole-heartedly. In the process Dean’s warning became a distant memory, something she more or less deliberately banned from her mind, not unlike how Sam ignored his death dreams about Jessica, so he could maintain his illusion of normal and safe. As for the YED, he has always been depicted as extremely arrogant, as someone who didn’t consider humans a threat, as his interaction with John or Jake clearly show. It’s totally in character for him to dismiss Dean’s threat as empty; in the end his arrogance was the downfall of the YED.



2. Time is changeable. The timeline we saw up to the point before Dean travels back in time was how the ‘original’ events played out and when Dean travelled back, his presence changed the timeline. While we are not privy to how exactly the events between 1973 and 2008 may have been altered, we can conclude from the fact that Dean returns to a (from his perspective) unchanged present, that his actions in the past had no substantial impact on the main events of his life up to this point. Details may have changed, but the end result stayed the same, as Castiel said, all roads lead to the same destination.



3. The third option would be that Dean did not really travel back in time, instead Castiel created an artificial replay of the events in the past in order to show Dean the truth. Either he created an alternative reality like the Trickster did for Sam in Mystery Spot or he showed him a high definition instant replay, like the YED did in All Hell Breaks Loose Pt1, only with the added possibility to interact or the events played out in Dean’s head, like the djinn induced fantasy in What Is and What Should Never Be. In either case, obviously his actions didn’t interfere with time at all in this instance.

So, however the show wants us to interpret the time travel aspect of the episode, I think it’s always within the limits of reason that the present remains unchanged for Dean.

What else was noteworthy?

(1) Dean’s habit of talking to himself when he is alone will never be not adorable and it’s even more endearing when he is talking to Sam in his absence. ♥ I just love that his need to share his experiences with Sam is so ingrained in him by now, that he just can’t help himself. Somehow this makes Dean’s trust that his brother is tearing everything apart in the future in order to get Dean back and Castiel’s reply that Sam isn’t looking for him even more heart-breaking.

(2) Talking of: Sam’s new habit to just sneak out on his brother and follow his own ambitions in secrecy terrifies me. Sam’s whole demeanour in the short scene in the beginning screamed determination and satisfaction about what he was about to do. It makes me wonder if he actually still wants to stay with his brother or if it is just a sense of duty or guilt that keeps him at Dean’s side at the moment. Although the last episode showed that he still feels the brotherly connection to Dean, his need for companionship with him might by-and-by be overpowered by his need to explore his powers. It wouldn't be the first time for Sam to leave his uncooperative brother behind until he got the answers he craves. Sam and Dean’s confrontation in the next episode will most certainly be explosive.

(3) I totally love that we revisited Daniel Elkins and the Colt. Another S1 reference that was logically incorporated in the plot. I really admire that Carver, who is relatively new on the writing staff, obviously did his homework!

(4) That Sam and Dean were named after Mary's dead parents was a lovely touch and Dean's 'you got to be kidding me' expression when he realised he was named after his grandmother was absolutely priceless. ♥

In conclusion: In The Beginning was probably the most important mytharc episode to date and a near flawless one at that. It completely infuses the earlier seasons with new layers of meaning and while I am sure that Kripke needed to rearrange plotlines and details in the overall story, I think it's stunning that the show managed to create this level of continuity and consistency from the Pilot on. I can’t wait for the next episode and see how it all plays out! ♥

* * *
Did you know? Jared had a couple of days off during the filming of the episode and took a short trip to Hawaii to relax. In order to tease Jensen with Jared's off-time from set, the crew was taping postcards from Hawaii on the front of the cameras while they were filming.

Comments

[impalalove]

The theory about Castiel doing this 'artificial replay'? That's interesting. :D

[galathea-snb.livejournal.com]

LOL thanks! At least that would be the absolut easiest explanation, since that way the original timeline was never touched. Less problems with timeline paradoxes. *g*

[denisitap.livejournal.com]

Sam’s new habit to just sneak out on his brother and follow his own ambitions in secrecy terrifies me.

Why? They are two different persons, with different motivations. Sam is training to fight Lilith, add Ruby, and that's something Dean is not going to understand, neither accept.

It makes me wonder if he actually still wants to stay with his brother or if it is just a sense of duty that keeps him at Dean’s side

*Auch* Do you really think that?. After he tried to sell his own soul and open the hell gates for him?.

I find incredible how fans keep hating on Sam just because he is doing something Dean is not part of.

[galathea-snb.livejournal.com]

I find incredible how fans keep hating on Sam just because he is doing something Dean is not part of.

Huh? I don't mean that at all! I love Sam to bits. I am just terrified for Sam's wellfare. As was said so many times: The road to hell is paved with good intentions. I just can't see how Sam doing exactly what the YED had planned for him can be a good thing for the state of his soul. He said himself that he isn't sure if it is the right thing to do but presses on anyway. I don't have a problem with Sam doing something without Dean, I have a problem with Sam maybe endangering his life and soul by doing what he does, with a demon at his side even.

*Auch* Do you really think that?. After he tried to sell his own soul and open the hell gates for him?

I didn't say I think Sam doesn't love Dean. He absolutely does, that's where his conflict arises from. He loves Dean but at the moment Dean is an obstacle to his actions and that's why he keeps everything a secret instead of coming out to his brother with the truth. He doesn't want to be forced to decide between Dean and his newly found satisfaction over his powers. So yes, I think that maybe there are moments where Sam thinks it would be easier without Dean, that doesn't mean though that he wouldn't do everyhing in his power to protect his brother.

It's who they are, family first, even if there are times in between where they have to fight for it. :)

[denisitap.livejournal.com]

The road to hell is paved with good intentions

I totally agree.

I have a problem with Sam maybe endangering his life and soul by doing what he does.

Yeah, maybe. I trust him though. I've always liked ambiguous characters. Neither good nor bad. I think Sam is going to make a lot of mistakes, but I don't think he is going to be evil :)

I have a problem with Sam maybe endangering his life and soul by doing what he does, with a demon at his side even.

I trust Ruby way more than I trust Castiel. Ruby seems faithful to Sam, Castiel follows his own interests. If Dean starts to question him, I can easily see him sending him back to hell.

He doesn't want to be forced to decide between Dean and his newly found satisfaction over his powers

Sam is doing something he doesn't want Dean to know, why? Because Dean wouldn't understand that you can use something given to you by an eveil been to fight another. To defeat Lilith, he needs to use his powers.

I think that maybe there are moments where Sam thinks it would be easier without Dean

All inferences. You usually hide things from someone if you're sure they are not going to understand you, or if you are trying to protect them. That's how I see it.

He fought so hard to bring his brother back, I can't imagine him wishing him away, even for an instant.

[galathea-snb.livejournal.com]

Yeah, maybe. I trust him though. That has nothing to do with trust from my side. I think that Sam convinced himself (or allowed himself to be convinced) that the end justifies the means. He deliberately stopped questioning his actions although he isn't sure if he is doing the right thing. I truly believe in Sam's goodness, that doesn't mean though that he can't be corrupted, given the right incentive, and the trauma of losing Dean might have just achieved that.

I trust Ruby way more than I trust Castiel. Ruby seems faithful to Sam, Castiel follows his own interests. If Dean starts to question him, I can easily see him sending him back to hell. I neither trust Castiel nor Ruby. Ruby isn't faithful at all to Sam: She admitted that she tried to manipulate him into using his powers because she thinks he is a weapon she can use against Lilith (NRFTW). Ruby has her very own agenda as well. Apart from killing Lilith she stated that she follows the YED's plans (TKAA). She left Sam to what she thought was his sure death when he didn't follow her suggestion to kill Nancy (JIB). So no, I don't think that either of the boys 'advisors' can be trusted.

Sam is doing something he doesn't want Dean to know, why? Because Dean wouldn't understand that you can use something given to you by an eveil been to fight another. To defeat Lilith, he needs to use his powers. Well, we don't know that. Lilith wasn't able to touch Sam, even when he wasn't using his powers. Who is to say that wiping out Lilith depends on Sam's powers alone? Also, all evidence in the show so far shows that there is the very tangible threat that using his powers is a danger to Sam's soul and/or humanity(see Ava, Jake or Webber). The thing is, Sam doesn't know what using his powers might do to him and he only relies on a manipulative demon. Usually Sam is so cautious, but he threw all his own doubts over board and that worries me.

All inferences. You usually hide things from someone if you're sure they are not going to understand you, or if you are trying to protect them. That's how I see it. No, it's not all an assumption. Sure, Sam is afraid that Dean won't understand him, but he also stated himself that he doesn't want to give up what he is doing, which is why he decided to lie to his brother. He knows that Dean will start to question him and he isn't ready to face that yet, because he has no answers. It's not at all about protecting Dean, it's about protecting himself.

He fought so hard to bring his brother back, I can't imagine him wishing him away, even for an instant. I don't think that either! I don't think he wishes Dean away! But we know from several occasions that if Sam thinks Dean or anybody else holds him back from doing what he thinks is the right thing to do, he rather leaves them behind until he sorted his things out. Sam's urge for independence has always been one of his strongest traits, that doesn't mean he doesn't love his family, but sometimes he prefers to follow his own path instead of trying to compromise. :)

[llywela13.livejournal.com]

Sorry to barge in. It's just that it really isn't about hating Sam just because Dean isn't included in what he's doing. It's about feeling very concerned about the path Sam is heading down. The fact that he feels he has to keep it secret from his brother speaks volumes, and he admitted himself that he isn't sure he is doing the right thing. He might be saving people, but doing the right thing for the wrong reasons doesn't make it any healthier or safer for Sam. He is taking guidance from a demon he knows to be both highly manipulative and has openly expressed her interest in the plans Azazel had for him and how they are connected to his powers.

Sam might believe that it is as simple as training to fight Lilith (except that I really think his motivations are more conplex than that) but that doesn't mean he is doing the right thing. And lying to his brother about it is only storing up more trouble for them both further down the line.

So...yeah, there's no Sam hate here. Just a lot of concern about where he is headed.

[denisitap.livejournal.com]

He might be saving people, but doing the right thing for the wrong reasons doesn't make it any healthier or safer for Sam

Ok, you think he is doing the right thing saving people. We agree.

Sam might believe that it is as simple as training to fight Lilith

And here you say he has also the right reason. Training to defeat Lilith.

This is what I am talking about. People turning facts into opinions. Sam is just human, and he is trying to do what he can to win the war, using what he has ^_^.

[llywela13.livejournal.com]

Hey, you're back online and writing! Good weekend?

I'm tired, so this will have to be really quick.

As so often it is Dean’s interaction with Mary though, that touched me the most.
His eyes light up every time he talks to her, full of the sheer wonderment of 'this is my Mom', four years old again. She holds so much power over him, and doesn't even know it.

if Dean hadn’t mentioned Liddy Walsh to Samuel, Mary and her father would have never been at her house, trying to save her and the YED might have never noticed Mary and targeted her and her family. That by trying to save his family Dean inadvertently caused the very events that would lead to Mary’s deal is an utterly devastating thought.
But on the other hand, Samuel was already hunting the YED (without knowing it), and Mary was a friend of Liddy. Chances are, even if Dean hadn't mentioned the Walshes, Mary could still have ended up on the YED's radar just through those facts alone.

I really can't decide if I think this was genuine time travel or not. I mean, if it was, then technically Dean should always have been a part of his own history and events should play out the same way. But John's journal said that Liddy Walsh was gutted in her home, which doesn't seem to have happened. So that's a change. But then again, the YED (in Samuel) was alone with her, so could have killed her without us knowing...

It is confusing! Paradoxes, huh.

It would also be interesting to know when exactly John did all that research.
I think the list was put together in bits and pieces over the years. I mean, technically, there was nothing in the story of what happened to either the first guy, the one Samuel was investigating, or to Liddy that looked like the typical hallmark of the YED. They were just isolated incidents that John heard of over the years and wrote down in case they were relevant. Whether or not he ever knew their true significance we can't know, just that he considered them noteworthy.

I feel I should comment more, but my brain is collapsing!

[galathea-snb.livejournal.com]

Hey! *hugs* Yeah had a good weekend! Just not much time for writing, so this one is shorter than I think it should be. Feels like I left a lot out. But well ...

But on the other hand, Samuel was already hunting the YED (without knowing it), and Mary was a friend of Liddy. The problem is, that Dean could exactly tell when and where the demon would attack next and I doubt that Samuel would have put that information together in time to show up there to save Libby. So, as I said, it's possible that the YED would have targeted Mary anyway, but still in this plot it was Dean who put them on that track. :)

I really can't decide if I think this was genuine time travel or not. Indeed, it's difficult to tell. The easiest explanation would be if it was an alternative reality, but I think the option that Dean has always been part of his own history is valid as well. The only difference we know happened is that Samuel and Mary interrupted the YED at Libby's and since possessed!Samuel was alone with her later, it is still possible, if not likely, that he killed her without Dean and Mary knowing.

Whether or not he ever knew their true significance we can't know, just that he considered them noteworthy. Hm, but Dean knew exactly what that list meant and how did he know that if not from John? It's all a bit fuzzy. We can't even be sure how long John knew at all that it was a demon who killed Mary. /sigh

[llywela13.livejournal.com]

It's all a bit fuzzy
LOL that's putting it mildly!

I can twist this episode so many ways - one minute I think it was just an interactive alternate reality created for Dean's explication, the next I think no, of course it was real, a paradoxical infinite loop. And then I argue with myself round in circles until my brain explodes!

I think next week's episode is going to be fairly crucial in aiding our understanding - finding out how Dean reacts, what he finds when he catches up with Sam, how much of a showdown they have and how much of what he learned here Dean shares with his brother.

Is it Friday yet?

[galathea-snb.livejournal.com]

ROFL well, maybe it's better to just accept it as it is and not think about it too much. For a time travel episode it was more consistent than I would have expected. LOL

Man, I so can't wait for next the episode, I am anxious about the confrontation between Sam and Dean. I so wish for both of them to come clear with the whole truth so they can find a way to come to a new understanding with each other and fight against whatever is in store for them together. I doubt it will be that easy though! Angst ahoy! /sigh

[3mmet.livejournal.com]

My (little) brother actually noticed right in the beginning of this episode that Mary said 'It's you' when she saw YED leaning over Sam's crib and completly freaked out over the fact that Mary knew YED from before. I kinda hate his quick mind for that because no longer than 2 minutes of brain work later he had come to the conclusion that Mary must be a hunter or somehow be linked to hunters. :P

"... it stands to reason that only in their pure form demons are denied that possibility, which would mean that the body the YED used in the Pilot or Salvation was indeed a materialization of the YED himself, rather than a possession. That would also explain why he simply dissolved when Sam shot at him in Salvation, while Dean was able to kill him when he possessed the janitor. It’s possible that they are only vulnerable to the Colt when trapped inside a person."

I like this theory, but then why would demons even care to hide inside human persons if walking with their material forms would increase their strength - making them permissive towards the Colt? It's not like they always needs to enter houses...

Aww poor Jensen, all work no play! ^^ As always, it was a joy to read from you again, your reviews always makes me understand the episodes on a deeper level - I'm slow :P

[galathea-snb.livejournal.com]

ROFL quick brother you have there! *g* Well, that Mary knew the YED is clear ever since the S2 finale, there could've been a gazillion of explanations though. My first thought back then was that Mary had been a psychic kid herself, one of her generation so to speak. It could also have been that the YED was breeding with human women and that Sam was a product of that. Funny enough, that she was a hunter never crossed my mind. LOL

(...) why would demons even care to hide inside human persons Well, they would be very limited in their possibility to move without a body to possess. We don't know how the materialized body of a demon works, maybe it's difficult for them to maintain that form and they can only hold it for a couple of minutes before they dissolve again. Also, the Colt was a myth for a long time, which only resurfaced 2006 and had limited amunition, hence the probability for a demon to be killed by the Colt was minimal and they don't actually have anything to fear within a human body. :) The Tammy demon in MM was even able to stop the bullet from within her human host. So, the threat of the Colt was practically negligible.

Plus, they often possess bodies that are useful to them, allowing them to gain access to certain people: like the YED possessing John to get to the boys and the Colt or the demons infiltrating the FBI (JIB) so they know when the Winchesters made the radar or Meg possessing Sam to get to Dean. Possessing people is a very useful means of infiltration. :)

Thank you! I am glad you enjoy my reviews. It's always nice to know that people read them. :)

[thandie.livejournal.com]

Oh wow, pretty cool! i agree with pretty much everything. Also, I had not thought about that this way, but the thing about the YED's true form being that dark figure, it makes sense! That's why he bleed from *his* wrist, and infact that was his blood, not the host's.


""Anyway, the new information opens up the question again as to what exactly the YED’s endgame was and if Lilith plans tie in with them at all. If the YED’s plans were the same as Lilith’s, wouldn’t the angels know about it? Why did all of Mary’s friends have to die in order to cover the YED’s plans? What kind of threat did they pose?""

Ok, here I think Lilith and the YED are on opposite roads. Lilith wants to summon Lucifer, while I think the YED's purpose was to become someone who could rule hell, he's an ambitious lad ;) So I think their purposes never meet because the YED wouldn't want to raise something who is stronger than him would he?

And about Mary's friends, I thought that they probably had to die because they were family's friends and maybe hunters, you know? That would make sense. They posed a threat in that sense imo.

About the time travelling thing: it's obviously point 2 or 3 of the ones you write. I personally think that Castiel bends the time for him and allows him to see the truth because Castile himself *knows* Dean can't alter events as we know them. Otherwise it's obvious that Angels would have already gone back in time and modified the events and resolved a lot of issues, if they are smart *lol*
About unchanging destiny, my opinion on the thing is that as Castiel says roads bring all to the same destination...this means that things that HAPPENED ALREADY can't be altered, so Mary has to die, etc...but things that have not happened YET can still be changed. So this means Sam can still choose the right thing.
SPN's take on time travelling is different imo from Back To The Future, I think they assume that time goes forward and the present can't be changed modifying the past. There aren't parallel lines (realities) that co-exist in the past and can change the present and the future, I think in SPN time is a only line. This means that destiny is something that exists in the present and can still be decided in the future. So acording to my opinion, sam can still choose, and if he doesn't choose wisely there's no stopping him going back in time to fix things.

Oh dude, i love your reviews, can we be friends? :)

[galathea-snb.livejournal.com]

So I think their purposes never meet because the YED wouldn't want to raise something who is stronger than him would he?

Hm, that's an excellent point! YED was one ambitious dude and his generations of psychic kids and the opening of the devil's gate don't really fit with Lilith's 66 seals plot. So I guess we'll just have to wait and see, but I would really want them to pull those two plots together somehow to create a continuity between YED and Lilith. :)

I thought that they probably had to die because they were family's friends and maybe hunters, you know

I was thinking about that as well, but then all of her friends died and given that Mary presumably left the hunter's life behind when she married John, I'd say most of her friends post-1973 would be non-hunters, who would pose no real threat. So I'll eagerly await the resolution to that plotpoint. LOL

This means that things that HAPPENED ALREADY can't be altered, so Mary has to die, etc...but things that have not happened YET can still be changed.

Well, that doesn't really sit well with me because if time is fluid then all of time is. When Dean travels back to 1973 his own past becomes his future and hence should be changeable again, even within your theory. Also what bugs me is that usually destiny is a term that refers to the entirety of a person's story, past and future alike. It's about the life being directed towards a certain, inevitable goal. I dunno, to only restrict the inevitability of destiny to the past, irritates me. LOL Time Travel really is a mind-bender. Overall though I think that the show will stick with the premise of free will and choice.

Friend away! :) Glad you enjoy my ramblings!

[sherrilina.livejournal.com]

I have a question--what happened to the "uncle" who buried Mary in the grave seen in CSPWDT? I assumed that was like Mary's brother or something, but maybe they meant great-uncle? Or maybe they forgot?

Since Mary knew Lyddie I wonder if she might have stopped by anyway....time travel is indeed rather confusing. I didn't realize that Dean was named for Diana, I thought maybe she named Dean for Dean (the one she just met!). I wonder why they named for the mother first?

Also when did the YED ever say that he can't bring people back from the dead? He said he couldn't do so without someone wishing for it in AHBL2, but someone wished for it....if he can't do it then how did he bring Dean back? :s

I loved this final reveal, and the fact that Dean finally knows about Sam's demon blood, can't wait to see his reaction, and see him find out about Ruby....the opening scene was very creepy! I wondered why Mary recognized the YED, I had wondered if Sam was somehow the YED's child, but I guess not....it makes sense that that must be his true form, since otherwise his host form's blood wouldn't be demon blood....

I can definitely see why you recommended watching MM first though, it does make more sense!

[galathea-snb.livejournal.com]

Well, we learned in The Kids Are Alright that all of Mary's friends and family were killed by the YED, so I guess it's fair to say that Mary's uncle was amongst them. :(

The YED said in In My Time Of Dying that he can't bring people back to life, but that he knows someone who can: The Reaper. He needed to possess the reaper Tessa in order to bring Dean back from the brink of death. :)

Heh, I was so relieved when the finally confirmed that John was Sam's biological son. I always hated the theory that Sammy was only Dean's half-brother. :)

Heh, yeah, MM is just completely wrong after Metamorphosis. Stupid network. *rolls eyes*

[sherrilina.livejournal.com]

What I mean is that there was no brother depicted in ITB, Mary appeared to be an only child....that's what I was wondering about! And why did he kill them all, surely she wouldn't have shared her deal with them?

Hmmm, I didn't think he meant the Reaper necessarily, that might have been because she was around anyway (and for effect), obviously Sam seemed to be able to come back okay without a Reaper being possessed....it could have been a Reaper standing by and the YED lying about he himself physically doing it....

And yeah, I miss the YED too, he was one classy demon, it is amazing how he was always the same in different bodies, although I liked the janitor form best...

I do think it's rather unrealistic how sweet and naive John still is after serving in Vietnam, ESPECIALLY as a Marine, I took a class on trauma and the Vietnam war and they really broke you down in marine boot camp, and even if not everyone got PTSD from the experience, it seems to me that nobody would turn out as sweet and happy-go-lucky and naive and innocent as the John we see on the show is after all that....even cooks would feel trauma!

[galathea-snb.livejournal.com]

Oh, Mary was an only child, in 'Children Shouldn't Play With Dead Things' Dean says that Mary's uncle put up her gravestone, so it would have been either Samuel's or Deanna's brother. ;) We still have no idea why the YED killed all of Mary's friends/family. /sigh

Hm, well, we don't exactly know how the crossroad demon brought Sam back, but I always assumed that the crossroad demons have special abilities, because they can obviously grant wishes that lie outside the abilities of normal demons as well, like healing deadly illnesses or gifting people with special talents (2.08). So, I think Sam was resurrected by the crossroad demon itself. I see no reason why a reaper should be standing by on John's death scene, doing the YEDs bidding. Reapers don't serve the agenda's of other creatures, they are independent. :)

Well, we don't know a lot about John's backstory, how long he was over in Vietnam and what exactly he has seen. He is still rather young when we meet him in 4.03, he can't have been in the army for all that long.

[sherrilina.livejournal.com]

Lol, I was thinking the mother was named "Diana" (but pronounced weirdly!) all this time (maybe because that's how you do pronounce Diana in Spanish), that is finally making sense to me now! :p

As for Vietnam the average age of the people serving was only 19 (vs. 26 for WWII), so there were a lot of 17 year olds (was possible with parental permission) and 18 year olds serving....the average term for Marines I think was 3 years at least, though usually only 1 in Vietnam (though that was more than enough--although as a corporal he might have only spent 6 mo with them, they cycled out officers, not sure which level though)....so he could have indeed served for a while and still be so young!